And how much more explaination do you need for me to get the "it's not neccessary for me to agree" message across?Kansho wrote:@Raven:
But Nasu thinks that even if they sacrificed things, they got plenty of happiness as a reward.
No, it's not the same. Shirou barely talked to Ilya in UBW except for the time she wants to kill him, there is no emotional attachment on a family level. He only went to her due to proffessional reason (need an ally) and even that didn't go too far. In both Fate and HF, she has become part of the Emiya family and Shirou pretty much regard her as such. His attachement to Ilya can be considered the strongest of the three paths even, hell Shirou risks his life several times in HF to save Ilya and he had explicitly expressed his desire to live with Ilya as a family. Yes, the fact that it's not possible, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a sad fact. Same with Saber, she made a contract, fight with him, protect him and died for him (before she's betrayed), she had intergrated herself as part of the Emiya family (even just for a bit), and he killed her - even if he has no choice, even if she's an enemy, even if she betrayed him, those things doesn't change the fact that she is Saber. And my last sentence is just a recital of what the game state at that point. If she's someone dismissable like you put it, then Shirou should not have that strong flashback upon her death.And with Saber, I only used the same argument as you with Ilya in UBW. She wasn't important here.
Sorry, I consider much more thing that just the story core itself, a story is nothing without a characters, and there are more to a (good) character then just being a plot device. Frankly, to compare the Ilya in UBW with the Ilya in HF or Saber is just being dismissive for the convience of "your" argument. Between the context of a stranger with a context of sister/combrade, what exactly is the same?
And why should I? I already told you if you want to drop, then drop it yourself, no one force you to follow the discussion anyway. At this point it's already clear my opinion is not just me alone, there are others for people who share what I think, I can still talk to them if we want since there is nothing wrong with it ... maybe except the fact that you don't approve it ... but who are you really? First you accused me a fanboy despite the fact I backed up my points, You dismiss most of what I said without any attemp for a real counter-argument, you declare the discussion is stupid, and now you want us to drop it because you don't like it? Do you ever stop and think you're acting a bit too arrogant here?And I really want to stop this, so please, stop.
I'll make one last attemp out of good will and give you the benefit of the doubt that this is all a misunderstanding.
- I never dispute what the game, or Nasu said. I'm start to getting a faint impression that you are thinking I mean "this doesn't happen in the game". I acknowledge what happens in the game, the point is I do not agree/like it. Common why is this so hard to accept, how many times you read a book or watch the anime that have an ending you don't agree with? Many time I bet. Does that mean you deny the fact the ending happened that way? No. Does that mean you have to like it? No.
- As someone already said, my line of thought is not really that rare among the F/SN fans that the happy ending of HF does not "click" with the "flow" of the story. In my respective, if HF needs a happy ending, it "should" be something like Saikano ending. Yes, I see Sakura last smile in HF, I know its exist, I know Nasu wrote that the smile is full and full-fillment. Point being, I just can not believe that smile, that's all there is to it.
- And again, the way you direct all the argument against you with the "Nasu said so" attitude is really out of place here, and I see you use it not just against me but against others as well. This line of argument is not about "What actually happened, what is the true path, what is the canon ending" discussion, if it is then you take the cake. However we're talking about "different ending, characters" on our preference here, and to put it short, Nasu's opinion on that matter is as good as anyone here as long as we can form our basic reasoning.
That is as far as I will go in trying to form an understanding between us, like I said if you want to drop, drop it yourself. If you still find yourself unable to adjust your attitude and form a mutal respect for my opinion, I will not drop the discussion but I will stop direct my point at you.