I reject Fate (SPOILAHZ)

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BlackTornado
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Unread post by BlackTornado » January 31st, 2009, 2:39 pm

sabata2 wrote:
Message wrote:On the other hand, what you could complain about is TYPE-MOON asking you to play some of the five endings in a very specific order.
Okay... yeah I guess that if that weren't the case... Oh, I dunno, say
► Show Spoiler
Then, yeah likely I wouldn't have much of a problem with it.
And who knows, maybe I'd have enjoyed Fate more had that been the case.
► Show Spoiler
After all, it HAS been around 2 years since I've seen the anime.
I get what your feeling. I think all the time that how nice it would be if every single one of mine choices could affect the outcome in a different way (be it big or small), just like it would in real life. However, you must consider (ok its not really fair since u have yet to play the other routes yet) the fact if other routes are available to you at the start, then every route must explain everything from scratch. Poof, and there goes the thing which makes fate/stay night stay out from the countless other mundane visual novels.

When you have played the other routes, you would find each vastly different from the previous one, each just as intriguing, if not more. Side characters who did not get much screen time at all suddenly comes into the spotlight and amaze you with their depth of character. This is only possible because you can only play the routes in 1 order; the routes can build and each other and not repeat the basic stuff over and over again (which is like in most vns, after you play the first route, you find yourself skipping most contents of the others cos they say the exact same story, only with a different girlfriend).

Fate/stay night the vn is 1000* better than the anime because of that. There are so many layers that can intrigue you even if you play through the game the second and the third (and the fourth.... ok maybe not the fifth) time. When you have played all routes, i strongly recommend that you play fate again. Only then can you fully appreciate what is going on. Do not dismiss it just because of a sad ending. After all, its the existence of sad endings that reminds us not to take the good endings for granted. :)
fourFyFSIX

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Unread post by Kid-Wolf » January 31st, 2009, 4:48 pm

BlackTornado wrote:Fate/stay night the vn is 1000* better than the anime because of that. There are so many layers that can intrigue you even if you play through the game the second and the third (and the fourth.... ok maybe not the fifth) time. When you have played all routes, i strongly recommend that you play fate again. Only then can you fully appreciate what is going on. Do not dismiss it just because of a sad ending. After all, its the existence of sad endings that reminds us not to take the good endings for granted. :)
That's because they knew what route would do what.
► Show Spoiler
- Finding my way through this garden is rather unbearable, but if it is to keep the one I adore company I will endure it for her sake, and her sake alone.

sabata2
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Unread post by sabata2 » January 31st, 2009, 8:05 pm

I edited the topic title so no more spoiler tags for meh!
BlackTornado wrote:I get what your feeling. I think all the time that how nice it would be if every single one of mine choices could affect the outcome in a different way (be it big or small), just like it would in real life. However, you must consider (ok its not really fair since u have yet to play the other routes yet) the fact if other routes are available to you at the start, then every route must explain everything from scratch. Poof, and there goes the thing which makes fate/stay night stay out from the countless other mundane visual novels.
But now, There's other ways that VNs can play out while keeping character depth as well as causing dramatic story changes due to your actions.

It may result in a sub par plot, but extraordinary characters.
Each choice will be a decision gate later on in the game, like if you let loose on Arc in the alleyway, or if you refuse Tokiha's help in Fate.
The game allows you to keep playing for a little while longer, giving the illusion of a successful choice only to throw you into a situation you weren't expecting where your choice 3 options ago sealed your fate.

And this could play out through the characters in ways such as jealousy, or anger.
"You met up with WHO instead of me?!" type stuff which could lead to later in game, that character not meeting up with you for the exact same reason.

Personally, I find stories about characters to be far more engrossing than stories about people in a plot. Which is my current interpretation of Fate.
How does Arturia react to learning about the Grail. How does Shirou react to being in a Magus War. How do they go about surviving.
It just seems to me that aside from Shirou (as you PLAY from his eyes), character development was on the backburner.

Okay, I'ma just stop there, cause I realized I was just about to start bashing the game itself and that'd just be hypocritical having not completed it.

Anyways, time to start UBW!

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Unread post by JLA » February 1st, 2009, 4:09 am

sabata2 wrote:
Anyways, time to start UBW!
It's my second time reading through UBW this time with voice over. Wow what a difference!
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Unread post by inferno_flamex » February 1st, 2009, 10:00 am

I do not reject fate...


I just reject its ending..

>_<

....
..........
...........

Yup... I sorta accidently remembered the ending once again when i completed Fate/Unlimited Codes using Saber...
...
Again... 3rd time now
...

T_T
Its like im CONSTANTLY being reminded of her ending... Even though i've somehow forgotten it!
"When a petanko hugs you, she's hugging closer to her heart"...
~:~:~
"There is no greater love, between a boy and his pillow"
~:~:~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZ_FT_c3IiQ

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Unread post by Rikh » February 1st, 2009, 9:04 pm

inferno_flamex wrote:I do not reject fate...


I just reject its ending..

>_<

....
..........
...........

Yup... I sorta accidently remembered the ending once again when i completed Fate/Unlimited Codes using Saber...
...
Again... 3rd time now
...

T_T
Its like im CONSTANTLY being reminded of her ending... Even though i've somehow forgotten it!
UBW pretty much contains fates good end...

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Unread post by nobaka » February 1st, 2009, 11:39 pm

Rikh wrote:UBW pretty much contains fates good end...
Do tell.

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Unread post by Rikh » February 2nd, 2009, 12:16 am

nobaka wrote:
Rikh wrote:UBW pretty much contains fates good end...
Do tell.
umm i wont spoil it... just one of the endings for the UBW route could be the closest thing to a Fate 'good end' possible

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Unread post by nobaka » February 2nd, 2009, 12:29 am

Rikh wrote:
nobaka wrote:
Rikh wrote:UBW pretty much contains fates good end...
Do tell.
umm i wont spoil it... just one of the endings for the UBW route could be the closest thing to a Fate 'good end' possible
Oh, no. I've completed all the routes. I don't consider it a 'good end' for Saber just because she's still around. :P

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Unread post by Qaynan » February 2nd, 2009, 1:30 am

nobaka wrote:
Rikh wrote:
nobaka wrote: Do tell.
umm i wont spoil it... just one of the endings for the UBW route could be the closest thing to a Fate 'good end' possible
Oh, no. I've completed all the routes. I don't consider it a 'good end' for Saber just because she's still around. :P
It might not be a good end for Saber... But I think it's probably a very good end for Shirou... hehe...
And actually why wouldn't be a good end for Saber? I thought it was pretty good for her too.
The magical energy emitted against the mere human called Tohsaka Rin is OVER 9000!!!!!

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Unread post by Shourai » February 2nd, 2009, 1:35 am

What nobaka said. Saber never found any meanings of her life, thus was never redeemed. She was "stuck" in present era with Shirou and Rin, just to become something like their "pet".

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Unread post by Qaynan » February 2nd, 2009, 1:41 am

Shourai wrote:What nobaka said. Saber never found any meanings of her life, thus was never redeemed. She was "stuck" in present era with Shirou and Rin, just to become something like their "pet".
Not really, I think she got over her "issues". And she was staying there by choice. She could have refused like someone else does. She just felt like staying would be pretty neat. At least that's how I understood things...
The magical energy emitted against the mere human called Tohsaka Rin is OVER 9000!!!!!

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Unread post by nobaka » February 2nd, 2009, 2:01 am

Qaynan wrote:
Shourai wrote:What nobaka said. Saber never found any meanings of her life, thus was never redeemed. She was "stuck" in present era with Shirou and Rin, just to become something like their "pet".
Not really, I think she got over her "issues". And she was staying there by choice. She could have refused like someone else does. She just felt like staying would be pretty neat. At least that's how I understood things...
I agree that it's probably the BEST End for Saber, but that's not saying a whole lot considering that in every other ending she's DEAD.

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Unread post by Shourai » February 2nd, 2009, 2:40 am

Qaynan wrote:Not really, I think she got over her "issues". And she was staying there by choice. She could have refused like someone else does. She just felt like staying would be pretty neat. At least that's how I understood things...
She didn't get over her issues. She stayed by her own will, yes, but the reason is contradictory to what you thought : she stayed to find the answer to her past.
► Show Spoiler
"He" in there is Archer. See? Saber was never redeemed except in Fate True End.

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Unread post by Rikh » February 2nd, 2009, 10:34 pm

Shourai wrote:
Qaynan wrote:Not really, I think she got over her "issues". And she was staying there by choice. She could have refused like someone else does. She just felt like staying would be pretty neat. At least that's how I understood things...
She didn't get over her issues. She stayed by her own will, yes, but the reason is contradictory to what you thought : she stayed to find the answer to her past.
► Show Spoiler
"He" in there is Archer. See? Saber was never redeemed except in Fate True End.
well i think that Saber gained a lot of Enlightenment from seeing Shiro and Archer's climax, Im sure she will be saved in the future of that game if she sticks with Shiro and Rin. After all, they both over the course of a few years could easily solve the most part of the moral learned in fate

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Unread post by Masterori » February 2nd, 2009, 11:00 pm

Since I don't know how the spoiler rules goes so...
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Unread post by allanh » February 2nd, 2009, 11:27 pm

I know that VN has a lot more content, however, anime has the advantage of background soundtrack/music + the animation to enhance the effect.

I somehow feel sadder watching the end of anime than I would have been after reading the Fate route of VN. The way the anime is constructed just bring tears to my eyes >< :oops:

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Unread post by sabata2 » February 2nd, 2009, 11:36 pm

Masterori, now that there's "Spoilers" in the title, you don't NEED a Spoiler Tag.

I think everyone else is doing it just to keep the endings and specifics of UBW and HF hidden from me. Cause they're awesome like that.

And part of what you said was true. I disliked it because I had "already seen it".
But as I said in my first post, When I heard about the game I was expecting an extra ending for Saber.
Only to be shot in the face about it.

Now as Message has suggested, if the game weren't just limited to Fate on your first run through, I probably would have enjoyed Fate much more.

Anyways, on to my progress of the one "day" per day...
That's harder than it seems. Not because I want to play more, but because I'm having trouble finding the time to actually play XD

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Unread post by JLA » February 3rd, 2009, 6:18 am

sabata2 wrote:Masterori, now that there's "Spoilers" in the title, you don't NEED a Spoiler Tag.

I think everyone else is doing it just to keep the endings and specifics of UBW and HF hidden from me. Cause they're awesome like that.

And part of what you said was true. I disliked it because I had "already seen it".
But as I said in my first post, When I heard about the game I was expecting an extra ending for Saber.
Only to be shot in the face about it.

Now as Message has suggested, if the game weren't just limited to Fate on your first run through, I probably would have enjoyed Fate much more.

Anyways, on to my progress of the one "day" per day...
That's harder than it seems. Not because I want to play more, but because I'm having trouble finding the time to actually play XD
I am doing OK on one day per day so far...
It's kind of neat going through it that way isn't it? :D

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Unread post by Raven » February 5th, 2009, 4:49 am

Heh, I'm more or less disagree with Message interpretion of the endings.

For me, the game has 3 independent story arch, they started at the same point but developed into their own completed storyline. What message describes is something more suitable for ... say, Wind: Breath of Heart where there is pretty much a single story line with minor twitch regarding the character you choose.


With that said, I'm on the same boat of finding the Fate's ending very unsatisfied. To put it frankly I don't want want to play a game in which emphasize the connection and grow of a character just to kill off the character end. I don't care if you call my shallow, neither I care if you want to argue "it's a beautiful" thing storywise, for thing like this happens in the a "romantic game" is just a cardinal sin. I prefer to have an "averga happy" ending over an "artistry heart breaking" ending so to speak.

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