matthewfarenheit wrote:Sex scenes
I won't emphatize on this. I had to add it as it was the obvious inclusion, that's it. You know they're weird, I know they're weird, that's about all there's to it. 5 ml of semen (assuming Shirou is a very productive person) are worth about 2-3 blasts with the more powerful weapon created by the World: yeah, sure. I'm really starting to ask myself why don't they have guys fapping at missile silos... Grotesque meat for the masses! I just tend to ignore the ero-scenes, concluding that they weren't added by the author but by a whole team of perverts that needed Fate to be classified as an Ero-game. I know it isn't true, but whatever: it still explains the massive ankwardness they give you better than most other arguments I can think of.
Some other things
*I readed on some thread that Shinji was going to be a lil' bit redeemed on HF when a badder person showed up: Zoken. Guess what? He didn't. Zoken was the bad guy that got the stardom, he got a nice brief scene of redemption with Illya, and that's it: Shinji just proved himself as the bastard idiot rapist he is and DESERVED a more painful death: the one he got was too painless for my tastes.
matthewfarenheit wrote:It has it's pro's and con's. For the whole Fate route you just scroll through text and learn a lot of things, most parts of the history fit together except some that you figure out on latter arcs. But this is the problem: the latter arcs take as granted that the reader already knows what the previous arcs revealed, that certain technicals things just don't need to be spelled out, and that's cool. But when it comes to "oh, we don't need to reveal Saber's identity anymore" or "we don't need to say that Shirou has Avalon inside his body" things start to get just weird.
Obvious question that any normal person would ask at certain points are not asked, and at some point you find asking yourself "are they just idiots?". The same is with the transition from UBW to HF: Who was Archer? it seems that everyone already knows, yet they never spell it out and you can't possibly be sure of those things. Hey, Kotomine just said "my servants are out", did you notice that he said that in plural, Shirou? Yes? No? They never answer this! And we read around 24 hours worth of text, obvious things like that seem deliberately left alone as to confuse the reader, and it's not like the VN really benefits from such a thing... Why?
And then, we have the nice addition of backtracking: you didn't know why Rider's nail stopped at Shirou's shoulder? Just check HF and then revive the old emotions! Don't know why Sakura acts ankward when Rin's present? do the same! So, in order to know what is the true ending in Fate, I have to play through Fate, UBW and finally HF: do not ask for a save or something because you're gonna be confused as hell. Then you'll discover things that apply to the rpevious routes, so if you want to see how they articulate, replay the previous routes! And if all this forwarding and backtracking starts confusing you, then you may be able to grasp why they are SO CRYPTIC!
I really don't have any way to explain this. They may have been running out of space in the DVD. Maybe a 4 CDs game instead of 3 CDs one was too much (I don't really know how many CDs is the CD version). It still doesn't make sense, but...
Example: Soichirou. In fate, he's barely on the screen, so it's ok. In UBW, revelation! he's Caster Master! He has a lot of character development, people loves him or hates him. Then in HF, he's dead. They don't even show him. Shirou's just looks at him with... spite? HE DOESN'T EVEN MENTIONS HIS NAME, neither does he show that much surprise about his teacher being a Master. Why? You just remembered he was your enemy? Did Shirou secretly wished for his history teacher's DEATH? WHAT HAPPENED?
Example 2: Saber. Yeah, Saber, the main heroine from Fate, gets an almost indifferent treatment in UBW and by HF they KILL HER by the 9th night. I won't explain myself much because she does get some cookies, but she's basically reduced to a backstage moe eating introspective person that doesn't deserve much screen time. Things that puzzled Shirou from the start on the previous arcs aren't even an issue now, even tough it's THE READERS that know them, not Shirou... whatever...
This whole text is not mean to be deep or foolproof, just to express what I thought was negative on what I consider a masterpiece, and as a whole can be summarized as a "nitpicking rant". What do you think?
Character differences between routes
This is less of a complaint that a statement of fact. If we are forced to play previous routes, and familiarize ourselves with the characters, why they suddenly change personalities on each of the arcs? The most notorious example is Illya on HF: WTF? I mean it: WTF??? She's the most adult-like person on the series in that arc, and in all the other routes she acted like a totally childish character (Fate) or about the same with an autistic sadomasochist touch to it (UBW). What happened? Did something HEAVY hit her head on the other routes? I know how it goes: she couldn't be developed enough on the other routes so they went all out on HF: Is that enough pretext? From a childish loli character to the most grown person in the series: character development for yah!
*Shirous new ideal on HF, shirou's old ideal in the rest of the routes: it's the same! What changes: being a superhero vs being the hero of the person you love? these are all coverups! What he really wants is no one to suffer, no one to die. He never embraced the "Kill one to save a lot" ideal from Kiritsugu, not even on the other routes, neither he considered other ppl disposable in order to keep the ppl he values: he just actively seeks a solution were everyone can survive, in all the routes. It just happens that in HF people died in the meantime, people he still wanted to spare. HE-NEVER-CHANGED-HIS-IDEAL.
*HF true ending being the "true ending for Fate/Stay Night": IT SUCKS! The first heroine we made a bond with, Saber, is dead and still in limbo looking for the grail. The main character is on a remote-control body that doesn't fit him too well while being stored on a loli body himself (yeah, Shirou is now a loli, ha!). A lot of people died, and the person that benefited from it the most is running amok. People that deserved a chance, like Soichirou, Caster, Lancer, Assassin, died a meaningless death. Well developed, likable characters Illya and Kirei: DEAD. Am I supposed to be happy because Sakura and his puppet-boyfriend-I-cannot-recognize-as-Shirou are looking at the cherry blossoms with happy music? GO HELL.
holydiver wrote:HF's ending doesn't suck:
Fate ending sucks, really.
NonExistence wrote:... would you rather have them retell you everything... three times? i think having the status and weapon screens was enough. also, the backtracking thing wasn't intended to be annoying: the author assumes that you have a brain capable of making connections between what you're reading and what you've read! (i know, it's shocking, isn't it?) it's called evaluation, and it's a part of higher-level thinking.matthewfarenheit wrote:...that's because they're on different routes. they are only useful as the plot devices that they are, even if they are main characters. therefore, if the plotline changes (which is what a route is), the importance of that person also changes. it's natural for that to happen in branching vn's. if all the routes had saber being the main focus, well... where's the fun in that?...you got that right. i personally think that a lot of the things you mentioned were justified and not negatives at all....
That's how 90% of visual novels works... And in this one is even more excusable because you are pretty much forced to follow a read order. And many people thinks that Nasu is one of those who must think that we are idiots, because he explain the same things one time, and another time, and another time...matthewfarenheit wrote:The arc/route system
That's typical in visual novels too. And Saber character-wise is pretty much covered in Fate route alone, so there isn't really nothing more to talk about her... You will hate Tsukihime then, with Arcueid not appearing AT ALL during almost 70% of the game...matthewfarenheit wrote:Reduced screen time for past arcs characters/battles
I think that we got glimpses of this in Fate too, but Shirou never managed to get a real brotherly relationship with Ilya in time. Then, she tasted blood killing Shinji and...matthewfarenheit wrote:Character differences between routes
*I don't understand what's your point with Shirou's new body. It's exactly the same as a normal human body you know? Only that without that additional Nerves-Magic Circuits that he trained along the years. Is exactly as they say, "it's the same old Emiya Shirou as always".matthewfarenheit wrote:Some other things
matthewfarenheit wrote:Ok guys, enough of analizing my own words: the thread was meant for you to say what YOU didn't like about the series, not troll myself out of it because I don't have enough of the fanboyish attitude you hold as necessary for a F/SN forum p
What didn't you like about the series? It's on the TITLE!
abscess wrote:matthewfarenheit wrote:Ok guys, enough of analizing my own words: the thread was meant for you to say what YOU didn't like about the series, not troll myself out of it because I don't have enough of the fanboyish attitude you hold as necessary for a F/SN forum p
What didn't you like about the series? It's on the TITLE!
Well... it's just that you already pointed most, if not all, of the main things I didn't like....
The rest are just details.... Like I didn't really like HF last CG with everyone standing there looking at the Sakura (the trees) or... something...
Welcome to Takeuchi's style.matthewfarenheit wrote:Yeah... don't everyone's asses look square-shaped on that pic? LOL
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