True power of Archer (spoilers)

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Unread postby Shourai » January 19th, 2009, 8:03 am

Xanathos wrote:
wyldfire wrote:even if arc creates excalibur it wont have the the abilities saber's excalibur...for example shirou/archer traces rock sword and downloads NLBW...arc creates the rock sword but there's nothing to download since its a completely different sword from what berserker used...it might not suffer from the global rank downgrade like shorou's though...


Come to think of it she would probably create something like what's in gil's vault. Splendid weapons without the fame or abilities.
The abilities are there... It's just they don't have name nor fame yet. :)
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Unread postby wyldfire » January 19th, 2009, 11:56 am

ya, exactly and neither can the abilities be used by arc...to do that she'd have to use that weapon throughout her lifetime and gain fame etc or be h4x like shirou/archer and download it...but, seriously who needs them when u have ur shinsou powers...shinsou beam FTW... :lol:
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Unread postby Rikh » January 19th, 2009, 7:16 pm

wyldfire wrote:ya, exactly and neither can the abilities be used by arc...to do that she'd have to use that weapon throughout her lifetime and gain fame etc or be h4x like shirou/archer and download it...but, seriously who needs them when u have ur shinsou powers...shinsou beam FTW... :lol:

Yah but arcueid could totally just create some awesome effect with the weapon using her own abilities... heck look at the completely non-cannon Battlemoon wars...

With her Marble Phantasm, she can use the most random powerful attacks besides clawing...
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Unread postby wyldfire » January 20th, 2009, 1:37 am

erm, r we drifting off-topic??? :oops:
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Unread postby Rikh » January 20th, 2009, 3:49 am

wyldfire wrote:erm, r we drifting off-topic??? :oops:

nah i dont think so, this is now focusing on Archer reality marble, and we are comparing it to Marble Phantasms. Although if its elaborated more, it will become off topic =P
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Unread postby spathi » January 20th, 2009, 3:59 am

on a completely random note:

can archer use gae bolg? like heart stab you to death?
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Unread postby Rikh » January 20th, 2009, 4:00 am

spathi wrote:on a completely random note:

can archer use gae bolg? like heart stab you to death?


in fatal fake he can :|
i honestly dont know about the real thing though. If shiro can port NP's abilities, then i would guess archer could do the same

Unlimited Gae Bolg Works? O_O
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Unread postby Qaynan » January 20th, 2009, 4:42 am

spathi wrote:on a completely random note:

can archer use gae bolg? like heart stab you to death?

Probably... he could... At least he was able to activate the ability of other NP before. So I guess he should be able to...
But it will suffer from a global rank down. Making it a C attack, thus probably failing more often on the luck roll. And Archer's affinity is swords... yes he can trace other stuff, but it cost him more. Shields are supposed to cost him 3 times as much. I suppose spears probably cost him a lot too. So I guess he probably just doesn't think it's worth the cost for him. After all, what makes Gaebolg so great is it's low cost and high return. If Archer made one, it would probably be high cost and low return... Not worth it if that is true.
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Unread postby Kikuchi » January 20th, 2009, 4:46 am

Qaynan wrote:
spathi wrote:on a completely random note:

can archer use gae bolg? like heart stab you to death?

Probably... he could... At least he was able to activate the ability of other NP before. So I guess he should be able to...
But it will suffer from a global rank down. Making it a C attack, thus probably failing more often on the luck roll. And Archer's affinity is swords... yes he can trace other stuff, but it cost him more. Shields are supposed to cost him 3 times as much. I suppose spears probably cost him a lot too. So I guess he probably just doesn't think it's worth the cost for him. After all, what makes Gaebolg so great is it's low cost and high return. If Archer made one, it would probably be high cost and low return... Not worth it if that is true.
I would think that even if it's said that Shirou's affinity is sword, they actually meant bladed weaponry. The name of the Reality Marble is Unlimited Blade Works anyway. Not to mention that there are some spears included in the CG where Archer made sword rain in UBW. :)
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Unread postby wyldfire » January 20th, 2009, 6:01 am

seconded...shirou's affinity is to bladed weapons...not only swords, although swords probably cost less....

and unlimited gae bolg works FTW!!! :D
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Unread postby -Shiki- » February 8th, 2009, 1:45 pm

wyldfire wrote:seconded...shirou's affinity is to bladed weapons...not only swords, although swords probably cost less....

and unlimited gae bolg works FTW!!! :D


how bout caladbolg?i think its still considered a sword since its a broken phantasm from a sword..am i right?
besides, what would happen if archer traced assasin's(sasaki kojirou) sword? :D even saber is cautious against it and is pushed..assasin seems underated..to bad assasin's GAR lvl is kinda low :P
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Unread postby Rikh » February 8th, 2009, 11:06 pm

-Shiki- wrote:
wyldfire wrote:seconded...shirou's affinity is to bladed weapons...not only swords, although swords probably cost less....

and unlimited gae bolg works FTW!!! :D


how bout caladbolg?i think its still considered a sword since its a broken phantasm from a sword..am i right?
besides, what would happen if archer traced assasin's(sasaki kojirou) sword? :D even saber is cautious against it and is pushed..assasin seems underated..to bad assasin's GAR lvl is kinda low :P
EX rank for archer

nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there
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Unread postby Xanathos » February 9th, 2009, 12:40 am

Rikh wrote:
-Shiki- wrote:
wyldfire wrote:seconded...shirou's affinity is to bladed weapons...not only swords, although swords probably cost less....

and unlimited gae bolg works FTW!!! :D


how bout caladbolg?i think its still considered a sword since its a broken phantasm from a sword..am i right?
besides, what would happen if archer traced assasin's(sasaki kojirou) sword? :D even saber is cautious against it and is pushed..assasin seems underated..to bad assasin's GAR lvl is kinda low :P
EX rank for archer

nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there


Yes it would. Archer and Shirou's tracing recreates the memory and history of the blade. That's how Shirou used Nine Lives Blade Works. The sword thing Berserker used was just a big rock. Heracles' nine lives is actually a style, so it could be used with a bow, a sword, a giant rock axe-sword, and a stick.
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Unread postby Shourai » February 9th, 2009, 12:42 am

Rikh wrote:nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there
Nine Lives (Shooting Hundred Heads) is a skill, not a NP... Hercules could also port this skill to a stick, fyi.
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Unread postby Xanathos » February 9th, 2009, 12:46 am

Shourai wrote:
Rikh wrote:nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there
Nine Lives (Shooting Hundred Heads) is a skill, not a NP... Hercules could also port this skill to a stick, fyi.


Nine lives is actually a skill and a noble phantasm. But it is not limited by weapon. (lol i posted the exacted same thing you said five seconds before you did. THIS IS FATE)
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Unread postby Shourai » February 9th, 2009, 1:02 am

Xanathos wrote:
Shourai wrote:
Rikh wrote:nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there
Nine Lives (Shooting Hundred Heads) is a skill, not a NP... Hercules could also port this skill to a stick, fyi.


Nine lives is actually a skill and a noble phantasm. But it is not limited by weapon.
The same could be said to Tsubame Gaeshi, then. :)
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Unread postby nobaka » February 9th, 2009, 1:06 am

Shourai wrote:
Xanathos wrote:
Shourai wrote:[quote="Rikh"]nope assassins sword wont work. Its just a long decent sword
His attack is a skill and not a noble phantasm. Things like Excalibur and stuff revolve around weapon innate abilities, but assassin could perform his technique with anything, even a stick. so it probably wont work there
Nine Lives (Shooting Hundred Heads) is a skill, not a NP... Hercules could also port this skill to a stick, fyi.


Nine lives is actually a skill and a noble phantasm. But it is not limited by weapon.
The same could be said to Tsubame Gaeshi, then. :)[/quote]

Tsubame Gaeshi isn't a NP. It's listed as a skill. Assassin has no NP.
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Unread postby Shourai » February 9th, 2009, 1:08 am

nobaka wrote:Tsubame Gaeshi isn't a NP. It's listed as a skill. Assassin has no NP.
Nine Lives (Shooting Hundred Heads) isn't listed as a NP either. The Bow of Hydra is a NP. Shooting Hundred Heads is a skill.
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Unread postby samasamon » February 9th, 2009, 3:49 am

NP refer to both of Weapon and Technique.

Excalibur (sword) is NP and Excalibur (blast) is NP.

Nine Live is adaptable; it can be used with any weapon (NP), while other NP (tech) associate with NP (weapon) such as Excalibur and Gae Bolg.

I doubt how many thing he can download. He can download Nine Live.
So when he fight DSB why he don't track Ex and download; instinct, magical energy release, leadership, track monohoshizao and download eyes of mind, knowledge of foremost harmony, track Gae Bolg and download rune magic, protection from arrow, battle continuation, track Rider's dagger and download superhuman strength, mystic eye, track some of Gil weapon and download Divinity A+, track rule breaker and download divine speed language, territory creation etc.
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Unread postby Shourai » February 9th, 2009, 4:10 am

samasamon wrote:NP refer to both of Weapon and Technique.

Excalibur (sword) is NP and Excalibur (blast) is NP.

Nine Live is adaptable; it can be used with any weapon (NP), while other NP (tech) associate with NP (weapon) such as Excalibur and Gae Bolg.

I doubt how many thing he can download. He can download Nine Live.
So when he fight DSB why he don't track Ex and download; instinct, magical energy release, leadership, track monohoshizao and download eyes of mind, knowledge of foremost harmony, track Gae Bolg and download rune magic, protection from arrow, battle continuation, track Rider's dagger and download superhuman strength, mystic eye, track some of Gil weapon and download Divinity A+, track rule breaker and download divine speed language, territory creation etc.
He cannot download innate skills that are related to one's Divine Blood or passive skills like Charisma. Only skills that were used alongside the weapon, like when he used Caliburn, and Nine Lives. That also includes Tsubame Gaeshi. Divine Words, Divinity, Eye of The Mind(Fake) are not used with the weapon.
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