How much is known about the first 3 Grail Wars?

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Yazan Kiriel
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How much is known about the first 3 Grail Wars?

Unread post by Yazan Kiriel » April 10th, 2008, 5:31 am

We know much about the 4th and 5th having the main stories take place in both. Only a bit of info here and there about the first 3 before it.

It's known the original classes were Saber, Lancer, and Archer. So more then likely, the 1st Heaven Feel was with those classes.

I dunno but it may apply to the 2nd as well. Seems not much information on this.

Now the 3rd...has a bit background to it according to some characters. Was during the 2nd World War according to Tokiomi and I think Kirei said that as well. Haven't read F/HA but I know about Avenger yeah and the tainting of the Grail during the conflict. If any more prequels shall come it's likely the 3rd Grail War we'll see of. Jeanne D'Arc would certainly fit well storywise in the timeline it takes place.

Is there anything other information or corrections about the first 3 Grail Wars?

Brizzle
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Unread post by Brizzle » April 10th, 2008, 5:42 am

I believe you are correct in your assumption on the third. The three founding families summoned each of the three knight classes and had them kill each other. It was a failure but they learned something.

All I've heard of the second is that the three families realized they needed outside help, and they developed many of the practices and rules of the later Rituals.

For the third, we know that the Einzberns summoned Avenger hoping to utilize a god, but instead getting a weakling. We also know that Avenger was killed on the fourth day by the Edelfelt sisters and their twin Sabers. Later one of the Edelfelt sisters was supposedly killed by the Tosaka master (I am convinced, and I have absolutely no basis for this theory, that Tosakas always summon Archers) and the other sister fled, leaving a grudge against the Tosakas that lives on in Luvia and Rin. But, supposedly, the other sister was not killed, but instead married the Tosaka heir (a reason why the Finnish curse gandr was added to the Tosaka crest).

We do know that Saber was one of the final two in the previous rituals.

As always, if someone knows better, please let me know if I've made any mistakes.
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DragoonKnight
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Unread post by DragoonKnight » April 10th, 2008, 7:37 am

So the third war had an extra Sabre and Avenger, meaning two classes must of kicked it.
We know that all previous servants couldn't have been "evil" and that Assassin class was always a version of Hassan i Sabbah.
What time did the Makari turn into the Matou?

Brizzle
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Unread post by Brizzle » April 10th, 2008, 8:09 am

Avenger was summoned instead of Berserker. The two Sabers counted as one (the Edelfelts had a familial talent of having two heirs), it was the same heroic spirit split into two.
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Oh yes, the Assassin of the 3rd Heaven's Feel had an interesting Zabaniya, Cyber Fantasy; using his left hand, he could turn an opponent's brain into gunpowder thus blowing off their upper body. I also believe I heard somewhere that he was a dwarf.
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Unread post by Enigma » April 10th, 2008, 8:17 am

I haven't posted in awhile, but i've been lurking. Also, add SPOILERS to the topic of the thread.


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Raitei
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Unread post by Raitei » April 10th, 2008, 8:20 am

Enigma wrote:I haven't posted in awhile, but i've been lurking. Also, add SPOILERS to the topic of the thread.


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"Introduce a little anarchy. Upset the established order and everything becomes... chaos.
I'm an agent of chaos."
Fate/world providence

miszou
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Unread post by miszou » April 10th, 2008, 8:21 am

Brizzle wrote:I am convinced, and I have absolutely no basis for this theory, that Tosakas always summon Archers)
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You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely

Raitei
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Unread post by Raitei » April 10th, 2008, 8:22 am

miszou wrote:
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Last edited by Raitei on April 10th, 2008, 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Introduce a little anarchy. Upset the established order and everything becomes... chaos.
I'm an agent of chaos."
Fate/world providence

Enigma
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Unread post by Enigma » April 10th, 2008, 8:22 am

Not what I meant Raitei. I mean two different people, not the same one.

Raitei
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Unread post by Raitei » April 10th, 2008, 8:25 am

Enigma wrote:Not what I meant Raitei. I mean two different people, not the same one.
yes, I suppose I understood you perfectly in my post before.
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"Introduce a little anarchy. Upset the established order and everything becomes... chaos.
I'm an agent of chaos."
Fate/world providence

Enigma
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Unread post by Enigma » April 10th, 2008, 8:29 am

Caster as a Berserker, eh...

Edit: Also, re-reading your post, you were right. I was reading your post but absorbing something else.
Raitei wrote:
Enigma wrote:I haven't posted in awhile, but i've been lurking. Also, add SPOILERS to the topic of the thread.


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How did the sisters of the third war summon two sabers?

AlinSabel
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Unread post by AlinSabel » April 10th, 2008, 8:39 am

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Raitei
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Unread post by Raitei » April 10th, 2008, 8:39 am

Enigma wrote:How did the sisters of the third war summon two sabers?
Brizzle wrote: The two Sabers counted as one (the Edelfelts had a familial talent of having two heirs), it was the same heroic spirit split into two.
"Introduce a little anarchy. Upset the established order and everything becomes... chaos.
I'm an agent of chaos."
Fate/world providence

DragoonKnight
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Unread post by DragoonKnight » April 10th, 2008, 10:24 am

I'm just very curious as to what heroic spirits Nasu would of used in the first 3 wars.

Oh yeah another fact, there was no church representative and wasn't far more civilian causalities as a result?

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Unread post by Kansho » April 10th, 2008, 10:54 am

In the HF2... probably.
見せかけの自分はそっと捨ててただありのままで
misekake no jibun ha sotto sutete tada ari no mama de -
Throw away the "fake me" quietly and just be myself.

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Unread post by Brizzle » April 10th, 2008, 1:14 pm

Ah yes. It was in the 3rd that Kotomine Risei was made the overseer of the War. Lots happened in the 3rd. =P

As for Archer in the 4th,
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AlinSabel
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Unread post by AlinSabel » April 10th, 2008, 8:48 pm

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Brizzle
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Unread post by Brizzle » April 10th, 2008, 9:42 pm

AlinSabel wrote:
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Nothing you've said here is incorrect, you'll just have to read further. :wink:
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AlinSabel
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Unread post by AlinSabel » April 10th, 2008, 9:52 pm

Brizzle wrote:Nothing you've said here is incorrect, you'll just have to read further. :wink:
Ah. Well, I'll have to wait for it to get translated, first. ;_;

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Unread post by DiMaggio » April 11th, 2008, 11:03 pm

I want to see how Saber and Dark Saber interact w/ each other.

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