Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby SolarAdept » June 9th, 2009, 8:58 am

Working under the basis that '1' is considered a normal value:

This means that '1' is the value used to count powerlevels, not the value of a human.

Forget about Lancelot(who was a normal human anyway) - if Assassin, who is established as just a normal human during his life, gets A rank then Satsujinki can get it too.

You are forgetting that Servants are slightly depowered Heroic Spirits, which in turn are only as powerful as they were during their life. Eirei-hood doesn't ADD anything to them, it merely... turns them into a Heroic Spirit.

AGI stat is general speed and dexterity. Assassin has the same speed as Berserker, no matter what excuse you use.(Of course, that wouldn't help him in a fight, but... that's a whole different story).

and the visual novel underlines his weak physical condition (anemia, no sport ect ect.).

This is as wrong as they get. The VN mentions that, while he is of bad health and thus forbidden from club activities, his physical condition is top notch. Otherwise, even with Nanaya out, he wouldn't be able to do a thing.

Just an off thing, but would you mind spell Satsujinki right? It really ticks me off somewhat to see the lack of two letters in the name for some reason.
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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby Vhailor » June 9th, 2009, 11:55 am

true, i don't know why i wrote Satsujin instead of Satsujinki.
Servants are not depowered eirei (well, depend on what you means by eirei.). It is specified that Saber under Rin's control is more powerfull than when she was still alive. Then, i don't know how and why Assassin Zero got a A rank Agi, but that doesn't mean Satsujinki can get it too. That just means humans can reach A rank stats and on this point, i agree. Lancelot, under a weak master is without ME B rank For Constit and B+ Agi. He is probably weakened. But that doesn't mean everybody on earth can do the same with some training. Lancelot is an extraordinary human being, he is not common. So, to a certain extent, that would mean Satsujinki, at the condition of if his body is able to do so, could get the A rank agi but i havn't see the slightest hint that he can.

I won't discuss anymore about the "normal value" thing, i clearly don't agree with you. To me, normal value = basic human and then, it build a scale to measure the power of a servants.

Agi stat : too vague in a certain way. That doesn't mean the same thing for Kojiro, Berserker and Lancer. All those guys are incridibly fast but not for the same reason. For exemple, Assassin got A+ agi but still, Lancer is the fastest and just got A agi.

Ho and what i mean when i said Shiki is weak is that he doesn't have any superior abilities (Except Meodp). He is a mere human just like us in Tsukihime, with some bad points too (his health) but no more. Nanaya, pushing his body to his limits, is able to do crazy things but Shiki can't. He doesn't have knowledge, training or even the slightest preparations (no sport activities.) and this is why Nasu said he relies on trump cards. Shiki is as weak as Shirou. By weak of course, i mean weak in comparison to Ciel, Nvrnsqr Chaos ect ect.
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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby Keeper of Gil's Vault » June 9th, 2009, 7:12 pm

In my opinion, Kojiro's A+ agility is a reflection of his Tsubame Gaeshi, since it is not accounted for in Noble Phantasms. If this is indeed the case, then an agility status of A+ essentially means that this individual can "be in two places at once". As Sabre pointed out, Tsubame Gaeshi is essentially a rudimentary form of dimensional interference, treading into the domain of Zelretch. I don't believe Shiki can achieve something of this magnitude yet, and also, he is no Kojiro.

Like Vhailor said, if the known Hassans can achieve an agility of rank A, then rank A agility is indeed within the potential of a human being. However, the problem here is constitution, not underlying potentials. The Hassans are battle-hardened veterans who underwent a life time of training. They had to fend off all other candidates to obtain the title of "Hassan". Shiki on the other hand lacks the extreme conditioning. An analogy would be a crammy computer (Shiki's average body) attempting to run a cutting edge program (Nananya blood). For him to get a rank A agility? Maybe after 20 or 30 years of dead apostle ancestors hunting...
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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby SolarAdept » June 9th, 2009, 7:21 pm

I believe that Kojirou's A+ in agi is not Tsubame Gaeshi, but his speed at handling a sword. Even without Tsubame Gaeshi, he is faster than Rin-Mastered Saber(only reason she could keep up with him was the Instinct skill).
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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby Keeper of Gil's Vault » June 9th, 2009, 7:49 pm

SolarAdept wrote:I believe that Kojirou's A+ in agi is not Tsubame Gaeshi, but his speed at handling a sword. Even without Tsubame Gaeshi, he is faster than Rin-Mastered Saber(only reason she could keep up with him was the Instinct skill).


This is not a convincing argument though. Sabre under Rin has an agility of only B. Being faster than Sabre does not necessarily mean Kojiro's regular swings are at A+.
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Re: Give Tsukihime Characters Stat Sheets! [Lots of Spoilers]

Unread postby Vhailor » June 9th, 2009, 8:01 pm

The number one reason he is able to overcome Saber in a duel is his incridible skill in swordsmanship. Well, in a certain way, it is something logic because technique is made to overcome our physical limits. Being fast is indeed a bonus but truthly, you can be veeeeeeeeeeery slow and yet deadly because you strike when you have to strike, in the exact moment you see an opportunity. It does not require to be haxing fast (i practice kendo for 8 years and i guess every martial artist would share this point.). But, this is a fiction and maybe Nasu see Assassin with A+ Agi not only for Tsubame Gaeshi but we don't know.
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